Are the ranking a farce?

[Arizona]

I have seen kids go from being ranked and not losing a match to not being ranked. I have seen kids with high rankings beating a kid unranked and not losing anything in the rankings. There are scores not being entered. Then I read about people crying about kids that they think should be ranked in the top 3 of thier weight class and the next week thier they are ranked number 3 and the previous week they were not even ranked. I know don't see every match like they do but I think some kids get the raw end of the deal. Don't take me wrong i know they do the best they can with the info they get--so i guess we will see how good they are when the final rankings come out at Assembly Hall in Feb. when we are standing on our feet cheering our kids on. Good Luck to all!!!!!

[Arizona]

Sorry- my statement about a ranked wrestler beating a unranked wrestler and not losing a spot inthe rankings, is i meant i have saw ranked kids beating the unranked kid by 1 point and stay right where he was at. Sorry again for the confussion.

[Dondo]

Sorry- my statement about a ranked wrestler beating a unranked wrestler and not losing a spot inthe rankings, is i meant i have saw ranked kids beating the unranked kid by 1 point and stay right where he was at. Sorry again for the confussion.

I would think most know that rankings are a "guide" and not perfect. It's hard to just base rankings on score alone, wrestlers "styles" play a role. I personally enjoy the rankings because it gives me the weight class of each. I predict my own rankings, and who really cares? Calling the rankings a farce is a bit extreme. I'm sure alot of time goes into.

[MR TWISTER]

I think that anyone that complains about rankings should do the rankings themselves for about two months. Then when you see how hard iti s to keep on top of each and every kids wins and losses every week for the entire state. It is very time consuming and no matter how hard you try there is always someone that will come on the internet and critisize how you compile the rankings. It is one of the most thankless things I have done in 50 years. And in the end they really don't matter. It is just someones opinion.

[fanofthemat]

Sorry- my statement about a ranked wrestler beating a unranked wrestler and not losing a spot inthe rankings, is i meant i have saw ranked kids beating the unranked kid by 1 point and stay right where he was at. Sorry again for the confussion.

There are way too many kids to keep track of everyone... Dont take it personally... Instead, if you know of results, post them in my new "Omitted Results" thread, so that they are seen.

[Arizona]

I think that anyone that complains about rankings should do the rankings themselves for about two months. Then when you see how hard iti s to keep on top of each and every kids wins and losses every week for the entire state. It is very time consuming and no matter how hard you try there is always someone that will come on the internet and critisize how you compile the rankings. It is one of the most thankless things I have done in 50 years. And in the end they really don't matter. It is just someones opinion.

If you would read what I said instead of jumping on the defense like you usally do. I said "THEY DO THE BEST THEY CAN WITH THE INFO TEY GET"
Read it again I think you missed it

[fanofthemat]

If you would read what I said instead of jumping on the defense like you usally do. I said "THEY DO THE BEST THEY CAN WITH THE INFO TEY GET"
Read it again I think you missed it

you also called it a "farce".... how is it a farce, if you insist they are doing the best they can?

[MR TWISTER]

If you would read what I said instead of jumping on the defense like you usally do. I said "THEY DO THE BEST THEY CAN WITH THE INFO TEY GET"
Read it again I think you missed it
I read what you wrote and I don't "usually" jump on the defensive. I have no reason to be defensive since you did not question my rankings per se. I was not even directing my post to you, I was posting to anyone in general. If you notice I did not quote you in my original post.

Now if you want to talk about your post I can and will. Your post is not the first one to complain about rankings and then try to qualify the post at the end. Rankings are hard and I feel if a person knows they are hard then why qualify a statement or post by saying "they do the best they can". If you really feel someone is doing the best they can then no need to point out if someone is not higher than someone else. And I still say people should try to do the rankings for a month or two, then post. If you are not part of the solution then you must be part of the problem.

I did them for YEARS so I am speaking from an experienced position...:cool:

[Theoneandonlyrankster]

It is still early people! Wait for a few more tournaments before everyone starts complaining.

[Highc95]

Listen Admin has a lot to keep track of (especially with three classes this year). He's human. He doesn't just put up names. Rankings take hours of moving and analyzing results each week. I'm going to go by the golden rule. If you don't have anything nice to say, then don't say anything at all. Its been beaten into the ground, no one gets a gold medal for being ranked first, they get a gold medal for winning first.

[titan442]

First and foremost, upsets happen. Just look at the NCAA basketball tournament each year. Just because a #6 loses to a #11 or even an HM, don't assume the rankings are wrong.

I've seen guys who were dominated, near tech falled, and pull out a headlock or switch to the back to win with a fall. Should the guy who pulled a victory from almost certain defeat be ranked higher? It's up for discussion. That's the fun part of it.

However, in my humble opinion, I remember WAY more times the rankings have been right than not. Two years ago, OPRF sent 8 wrestlers to state. I printed out brackets and listed Illinois Matmen's rankings next to each ranked wrestler. Watching the tournament, most matches went the way the rankings went. I was very impressed.

Personally, I get to enjoy the rankings on Illinois Matmen for free (or free with donation support), as it's a STARTING POINT to a discussion about who's better than whom. I don't wholeheartedly expect a higher ranked wrestler to win. You still have to wrestle the matches.

And there are myriad reasons why a wrestler could lose on a particular day. Maybe his girlfriend just broke up with him. Maybe his parents are going through a divorce. Maybe he pulled a muscle in practice. Who knows. Stuff happens.

Personally, I love the rankings. It's a great way for me to quickly learn who's who in wrestling this year. If you don't like the rankings for whatever reason, make suggestions to the creators about what they could do to improve them. If you still don't like the rankings, don't fret, just create your own rankings! :)

Being a teacher, I know how awful it is to do so much for a community and not get a thanks for it. So, let me send a virtual gift to all the people who work so hard on Illinois Matmen. Thank you all so much. My life is more fun because of you. Keep up the awesome work!!

[Formerwrestler]

I completely agree! Besides noone is every gonna get it 100% right. Vegas doesn't even get the odds 100% right on everything, and that is done by a mathematical method which is computerized! Their are upsets every year that people don't know how they happen, and just see a loss on their record. Although one kid could've been a ranked wrestler winning the match by a large margin and got caught as everyone knows! Overall rankings, very good!

[birdwatcher35]

First and foremost, upsets happen. Just look at the NCAA basketball tournament each year. Just because a #6 loses to a #11 or even an HM, don't assume the rankings are wrong.

I've seen guys who were dominated, near tech falled, and pull out a headlock or switch to the back to win with a fall. Should the guy who pulled a victory from almost certain defeat be ranked higher? It's up for discussion. That's the fun part of it.

However, in my humble opinion, I remember WAY more times the rankings have been right than not. Two years ago, OPRF sent 8 wrestlers to state. I printed out brackets and listed Illinois Matmen's rankings next to each ranked wrestler. Watching the tournament, most matches went the way the rankings went. I was very impressed.

Personally, I get to enjoy the rankings on Illinois Matmen for free (or free with donation support), as it's a STARTING POINT to a discussion about who's better than whom. I don't wholeheartedly expect a higher ranked wrestler to win. You still have to wrestle the matches.

And there are myriad reasons why a wrestler could lose on a particular day. Maybe his girlfriend just broke up with him. Maybe his parents are going through a divorce. Maybe he pulled a muscle in practice. Who knows. Stuff happens.

Personally, I love the rankings. It's a great way for me to quickly learn who's who in wrestling this year. If you don't like the rankings for whatever reason, make suggestions to the creators about what they could do to improve them. If you still don't like the rankings, don't fret, just create your own rankings! :)

Being a teacher, I know how awful it is to do so much for a community and not get a thanks for it. So, let me send a virtual gift to all the people who work so hard on Illinois Matmen. Thank you all so much. My life is more fun because of you. Keep up the awesome work!!


Great post Titan!!! I for one definitely appreciate the hard work and effort that we get VOULENTARILY from the rankers.

[wrestleu135]

First and foremost, upsets happen. Just look at the NCAA basketball tournament each year. Just because a #6 loses to a #11 or even an HM, don't assume the rankings are wrong.

I've seen guys who were dominated, near tech falled, and pull out a headlock or switch to the back to win with a fall. Should the guy who pulled a victory from almost certain defeat be ranked higher? It's up for discussion. That's the fun part of it.

However, in my humble opinion, I remember WAY more times the rankings have been right than not. Two years ago, OPRF sent 8 wrestlers to state. I printed out brackets and listed Illinois Matmen's rankings next to each ranked wrestler. Watching the tournament, most matches went the way the rankings went. I was very impressed.

Personally, I get to enjoy the rankings on Illinois Matmen for free (or free with donation support), as it's a STARTING POINT to a discussion about who's better than whom. I don't wholeheartedly expect a higher ranked wrestler to win. You still have to wrestle the matches.

And there are myriad reasons why a wrestler could lose on a particular day. Maybe his girlfriend just broke up with him. Maybe his parents are going through a divorce. Maybe he pulled a muscle in practice. Who knows. Stuff happens.

Personally, I love the rankings. It's a great way for me to quickly learn who's who in wrestling this year. If you don't like the rankings for whatever reason, make suggestions to the creators about what they could do to improve them. If you still don't like the rankings, don't fret, just create your own rankings! :)

Being a teacher, I know how awful it is to do so much for a community and not get a thanks for it. So, let me send a virtual gift to all the people who work so hard on Illinois Matmen. Thank you all so much. My life is more fun because of you. Keep up the awesome work!!

Nicely put Titian

[MSLHWYDAD]

The rankings are only as good as the information those doing the rankings have....and only for that day they come out. Rankings give all of us something to talk about and help keep up the excitement about future matches. There is a down side as well. Wrestlers themselves use the site to gain information and some, allow themselves to be beaten before they even walk on the mat. Long and short, they are what they are.......(sounds a little like Dennis Green!)

[MR TWISTER]

First and foremost, upsets happen. Just look at the NCAA basketball tournament each year. Just because a #6 loses to a #11 or even an HM, don't assume the rankings are wrong.

I've seen guys who were dominated, near tech falled, and pull out a headlock or switch to the back to win with a fall. Should the guy who pulled a victory from almost certain defeat be ranked higher? It's up for discussion. That's the fun part of it.

However, in my humble opinion, I remember WAY more times the rankings have been right than not. Two years ago, OPRF sent 8 wrestlers to state. I printed out brackets and listed Illinois Matmen's rankings next to each ranked wrestler. Watching the tournament, most matches went the way the rankings went. I was very impressed.

Personally, I get to enjoy the rankings on Illinois Matmen for free (or free with donation support), as it's a STARTING POINT to a discussion about who's better than whom. I don't wholeheartedly expect a higher ranked wrestler to win. You still have to wrestle the matches.

And there are myriad reasons why a wrestler could lose on a particular day. Maybe his girlfriend just broke up with him. Maybe his parents are going through a divorce. Maybe he pulled a muscle in practice. Who knows. Stuff happens.

Personally, I love the rankings. It's a great way for me to quickly learn who's who in wrestling this year. If you don't like the rankings for whatever reason, make suggestions to the creators about what they could do to improve them. If you still don't like the rankings, don't fret, just create your own rankings! :)

Being a teacher, I know how awful it is to do so much for a community and not get a thanks for it. So, let me send a virtual gift to all the people who work so hard on Illinois Matmen. Thank you all so much. My life is more fun because of you. Keep up the awesome work!!You are so welcome. In the end it is a labor of love....:D

[doubleleg]

I appreciate all the work the folks at Matmen do especially with the rankings!!! It's what got me back into following wrestling 4 years ago after a 20 year layoff. The rankings are a great way to track kids who I would otherwise have no idea about as I don't get to the regular season duals. It's exciting every year to have the rankings in my back pocket and compare how things playout in Champaign!

On the subject of rankings and excuse me if I missed this in a previous thread; I'm wondering if anyone can give me some background on the kid ranked #1 at 171. He's got to be outstanding to be ranked ahead of Munster?

By the way, I also enjoy all the posters out there!!!! It's great entertainment during these winter months and is a great replacement for the time I normally would be spending on the golf course!!!

[wise guy08]

On the subject of rankings and excuse me if I missed this in a previous thread; I'm wondering if anyone can give me some background on the kid ranked #1 at 171. He's got to be outstanding to be ranked ahead of Munster!!
He (stenberg) was hurt a lot last year. I belief he is ranked over him becaue he did really well over the off-season. Also the rankesters are probably not sure how he (munster) will handle the weight adjustment. From 119 to 140 to 171.
should be a good one when those two face

[doubleleg]

thanks for the info wiseguy... Will they meet before the state tournament? Lee's growth over two years is amazing. I've heard he's put on a ton of muscle? I'm assuming he's not cutting any weight?

[Italiano]

this thread is ridiculous. the rankings are not a farce. People put their time and effort in doing this for us. They dont need to, but its a nice thing to have. These people are not omniscient, so they cant know every single thing about every single wrestler. The rankings dont matter, its all about what happens downstate. Im sure a kid would rather be an HM and win state than be ranked #1 by some people's accounts and then not place downstate. I personally enjoy the rankings quite thoroughly, and i thank whoever does it.

[Twenty4/7]

thanks for the info wiseguy... Will they meet before the state tournament? Lee's growth over two years is amazing. I've heard he's put on a ton of muscle? I'm assuming he's not cutting any weight?
stenberg wrestled around. 119 as a freshman, he has gone up ever since. I can assure you he is one of the biggest 171 lb kids you will see. he has to be one of the most dedicated kids to weight lifting i have ever met. let me just say this. He has the school record for cleans at 300 POUNDS!! Luke roth had the record at 225 when he was a junior i dont know if it was still the record. Stenberg benches over 315 lbs and if you ask him he will say his legs are his strong point... And thats besides the fact that hes also a great wrestler. Should be an awesome year.