State series observations

[blaze]

Now that the state series is close, I would like to say that this state has some of the best and deepest wrestling of any in the country. As a long time official of Ohio and Illinois, the IL state series is one the best run and best wrestled in the country.

With that being said, an observation that I have always had is that when all is said and done rankings are nice but they do not mean everything or at times anything. The biggest thing when it comes to state is the matchup of styles. Although wrestlers vary every year from team to team, there are generalizations that can made about the overall team style of wrestling. This post is not made to bash any team or program but to make wrestlers aware of what they are in for in a match with some of the top programs (strengths/weaknesses).

Providence-relentess team on the mat with the mills series from the sprial ride, yet on the feet very counter-offensive wrestling, will wait for opponent to get frustrated and captilize, plays the edge of the mat extremely well- yet not viewed as stalling because they work extremely hard to position themselves there and do enough not to get called for it.

St. Rita-Solid all-around wrestling, nice use of high-crotch penetration to set-up other moves/finishes on the feet. Will run more moves than PC from the top, but mills is still a huge staple, also wrist rides and bars. Quick to escape from bottom with stand-ups and an occasionsal granby. More diverse than in all facets of wrestling than PC which allows each wrestler to show a little more of their indivduality on the mat.

Neuqua Valley-Hard-nosed yet sometimes less experienced in bigger matches, solid doubles from most and outside singles from all. Will run 2 on 1s from top, along with wings and mills. There are few exceptions on this years team like Holley who is an octopus on the mat and Hightower who is a physical specimen and bear on his feet but weaker on the mat. Probably more Overtime kids than any other team in state because of location and Spangler's dad, enough said

Glenbard North-If their nickname were bulldogs it would be appropriate. Bully weaker wrestlers into mistakes and capitalize on them. The least technically sound of these teams; they rely on a few strength moves but basically the fundamentals of wrestling, bang the head doubles, hi-c's, and singles are the norm and they are relentless. When wrestling better competition they will work the edge almost as well as PC yet will get called more for stalling than PC. If they are losing a match, anything is within reason in order to win so you cannot sit on a lead against these guys because they have a whole other gear if they are down in a match. I always use to joke with the other officials that it is a "fear" gear for fear of losing. Not a bad thing to have.

Sandberg-The best thing going for themr the past few years is Eric Siebert. He and the other coaches have brought another level to that program yet some things are the same. Great low level attacks with the ability to change directions once their first move is stopped. Tremendous riders with a great wrist ride on the feet as well as the mat. Extremely versed in the use of legs and know about every counter a team will throw at them for legs/leg ride and will counter that for points.

I hope this helps the kids on teams who have only one state qualifier or have never seen these teams before. Again once your down at Assembly a lot of times styles will dictate who will win the big matches and why you think a match should go one way but goes the completely other direction i.e.Poeta/berman/klinger, Giese, Gable, Tannenbaum, etc.

I would love to know what you all think and if you would like to hear about other teams or whatever, let's get this forum going!

[Mike]

Very interesting. I'd love to hear about more schools. I am most interested in the Bloom sectional teams if you're takeing requests.

Thanks,
Mike

[MR TWISTER]

That was a very interesting post. Of course I would be interested in your opinion on Mt. Carmels style. I know that since Ben Gerdes became head coach they have tried to establish a particular style of wrestling as a team. I know what that is but I would be interested to shear your opinion and observations on MC over the last two or three years. Thanks

[blaze]

Twist-
I have only seen you guys once this year and it was early. But as far as the past here goes- The better MC wrestlers are extremely different from each other. I can find a few similarities between them, lets say someone like the Currans,Charles Lloyd, the williams, and even your son. Obviously this has to do with the huge difference in weight but some program wide styles are: a constant motion of hands and feet, more so than PC/STR. Great low level attacks, usually a freeze step-explosive straight forward leg attack ala John Smith with a change up if initial shot is blocked or countered. Will be more agressive than either rita or PC because reward is worth the risk. Even if they get down a few points off an aggressive mistake, there is always a deep well of five pointers in their bag. This goes back to the twister days of old. Also good riders but won't force anything, will cut to takedowns again if they feel they are expending too much energy with no points. Of course down state this changes; MC will ride you out at assembly although I would cut my opponent because program wide MC is more explosive on the feet than 98% of the programs I have seen. Stick with what works and unfortunatly in the years where some of your kids have not reached their goals,I feel it is because they didn't stay true to themselves. If you can escape from bottom and you can get takedowns at will, you can win every match no matter if it is a dual or the championship. As far as Bloom, Sandburg and PC are there, who else would like my take on? Plainfield Central is a scaled down version of GBN, tough physical, but not as skilled as any CCL team or Sandburg. Strength is great which they have, strength and technique is even better. I will take a technician over a weight-room kid any day. But of course I'll take a little of both. Good luck to Mario, he's looked good, I'll see you downstate.
;)

[karem gaber]

Mt Carmels style can differ quite a bit between alot of their wrestlers. Over the past 15 years, the great majority of wrestlers with an "aggressive style" have come from the Twister club. Besides that, their wrestlers are great at stalling and only taking shots on the edge. I dont know if Gerdes has changed that, but that is how it has been.

[muletrain]

Wow interesting post, good job. I agree with a lot of what you said.

Providence, for example, is a very basic, meat and potatoes style of wrestling. Simple, grinding, mat-oriented style. You don't see much for fancy granbys or leg rides. Mostly spirals, half and cradles on top, standups on bottom, singles/doubles from neutral. Simple but brutally effective nonetheless. The styles of the Montini, SR and MC does vary a bit more than PC but they all seem be a little more explosive, especially some of the MC guys.

I'm from Rockford/Belvidere area so I can probably best comment on the AA and the better A schools I see from around there. It's funny you mentioned that "whole other gear" thing if they are down in a match. A couple other teams I notice that also have that are Hononegah and Dekalb. They are tough to beat whether you are winning or losing.

Rockford area schools like Harlem, Belvidere, and the smaller schools like Byron, SV tend to wrestle a pretty similar, conservative but hard-nosed style. They don't make many mistakes but they don't take lots of risks either. These teams, especially Hononegah and Dekalb always seems to produce strong, well conditioned wrestlers that can go the distance and who are also technically sound.

Dundee Crown cranks out lots of tough wrestlers and every year they seem to replenish their ranks. Not many badass level guys but dozens of workhorses. When I was growing up, though they always had a bit of a bad reputation around the northern Ill area as stallers and rule benders with something of a win-at-all-costs mentality. Not sure if that's still the case, at any rate they still seem to win pretty consistently with a simple in-your face style.

Anyways that's my 2 cents...

[Another Fan]

St. Laurence, they have a very interesting style. They absolutely love to try and wrestle off their backs. Of course, this never works. If i were Camer i would try to change up that program a little bt and quit teaching the kids how to count lights.

[jrbu]

Easy, this is Coach Camers first year!! He is a good guy and will be a great coach, if he gets the support of his AD. He has alot of work to do but if you look at how well he has worked with Sands you can see that he will be alright. Alot of people thought that when Sands left the Rita's wrestling room he would fall off. No luck, Camer has done a GREAT job in a short time to make that team more competitive. Just wait till he brings back some support from a feeder program, something that STL hasn't had since the glory days of the Burbank Panthers.