Oklahoma State, IL recruiting

[wrestlersdad]

Originally Posted by MR TWISTER

I disagree slightly. Now because I worked with him so closely I must refer to my own son. I know first hand the initial frustration when he lost 19 matches his freshman year yet usually had 5 takedowns in the match and would lose to a riding point. I know firsthand what it was like to watch him get rode for 6:00 in the NCAA tournament AA by the evential champ because he could not get off the bottom. That simple thing was the difference between being a 4x AA and a 3x AA.

Some lessons are hard learned but they must be learned.

You can do takedowns/let 'em up as long as when it is time to ride you can ride and when it is time to get off the bottom you can get off the bottom. I don't think Mario abandoned his take 'em down style that he learned with the Twisters. When he needed a takedown to win (as he often did) he was able to get it. This is an area that I am glad he had in his back pocket. And one of the great things about his coach, he never subtracted from his style, he got his wrestler to add what he needed. It is hard to learn to ride in hs because the elite guys don't have to ride to win nor do they get points for riding. Now if the rules were the same as college that would be a different thing. At this point the difference in the rules hurt our hs wrestlers, especially our elite guys.

What Mario did do was he came to the realization that he must in close matches be able to ride or get out. Most college matches are close so getting 5 takedowns don't mean didly cause the other guy can also get 5 and a riding point. Then what do you do - the match is over. I think kids from Illinois sometimes refuse to adapt to these two areas and stubbornly continue to just try to do takedowns.

Just my observations....everyone in this thread breath...

I will defer to the experts, but the PA guys seem to be able to learn how to ride in high school.

[Greenskin]

Originally Posted by wrestlersdad

I will defer to the experts, but the PA guys seem to be able to learn how to ride in high school.

It is a part of the sport that gets glossed over in Illinois. It is as teachable and learnable as wrestling on your feet. It is more tiring, takes more strength, allows for no breaks and results in cauliflower ears, scrapes and burns. There is little flair or glamour. It's focus is more on strength and leverage than speed or exceptional quickness. But it is a crucial part of folkstyle wrestling and those who learn these skills are going to have a few more "bullets in their gun".

It's kind of like a pitcher in baseball that never bothers to learn how to hold a runner on base. As long as he gets them out he doesn't have to worry about them stealing second and getting in scoring position. Problem is, you don't get everybody out. Sometimes you don't get enough takedowns either.

[larry b]

How rude of me to ask your name. You being the sensitive type.I am very sorry. I am very impressed .With your ability to spin discussions and your lacing of information with misinformation figured you would be much to busy yesterday to spend time posting.

[larry b]

The video was not taken by me .Found when I attempted to video we got to see a whole more of the floor than any of the match'

[MR TWISTER]

Originally Posted by wrestlersdad

I will defer to the experts, but the PA guys seem to be able to learn how to ride in high school.

Yeah but can they get a takedown when they need one if we have the advantage and put them on their feet in the third? See it is half a dozen of one and none of the other.

I prefer to say that no state has the complete (all three top, ottom, neutral) wrestler coming out of h.s. all states have a weakness. It is just that IL weakness is something that our guys are not picking up soon enough to win national titles.

[wrestlersdad]

Originally Posted by MR TWISTER

Yeah but can they get a takedown when they need one if we have the advantage and put them on their feet in the third? See it is half a dozen of one and none of the other.

I prefer to say that no state has the complete (all three top, ottom, neutral) wrestler coming out of h.s. all states have a weakness. It is just that IL weakness is something that our guys are not picking up soon enough to win national titles.

If PA's weakness is on their feet and Illinois' weakness is wrestling on the mat and PA is the better wrestling state when it comes to college results, then is wrestling on the mat more critical to college success than on your feet?

[advocate]

Originally Posted by wrestlersdad

... then is wrestling on the mat more critical to college success than on your feet?

Yes ... I have been told, by several college coaches, mat wrestling is more critical ... esp. to early success in college.

[James_Oliva]

Originally Posted by MR TWISTER

Yeah but can they get a takedown when they need one if we have the advantage and put them on their feet in the third? See it is half a dozen of one and none of the other.

I prefer to say that no state has the complete (all three top, ottom, neutral) wrestler coming out of h.s. all states have a weakness. It is just that IL weakness is something that our guys are not picking up soon enough to win national titles.

I'd look at those NCAA results and say..."yes they can."

[greenlantern]

Originally Posted by wrestlersdad

If PA's weakness is on their feet and Illinois' weakness is wrestling on the mat and PA is the better wrestling state when it comes to college results, then is wrestling on the mat more critical to college success than on your feet?

ive been saying that for a few years and i get blasted. People on this board like to make excuses and moral victorys instead of saying pa/nj is better there coachs do better job of preparing them for college and so on

[James_Oliva]

Originally Posted by greenlantern

ive been saying that for a few years and i get blasted. People on this board like to make excuses and moral victorys instead of saying pa/nj is better there coachs do better job of preparing them for college and so on

I've been saying the same thing on here since 2003. It's the messenger, not the message.