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Reverse Fig-4 HeadScissor hold/pin

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  • Reverse Fig-4 HeadScissor hold/pin

    anybody else out there love to use this hold? I find it very effective to pin

    looking for thoughts/ideas about the hold... I've never had the hold applied to me.... so anybody on the receiving end can add to discussion...

    does your team coaches teach the hold and actively encourage it? do any of your team members use the hold as well?
    Attached Files

  • #2
    Kind of an horrible position to be pinned in lol. All I can say is losing stinks.

    Comment


    • #3
      The third pic almost looks illegal. I used to use this a lot in high school, but I've had several refs stop the hold even though I kept it legal. Many of them didn't even know a fig 4 on the head is legal. Also, since you are parallel with the guy you are in dangerous trouble of getting rolled before you can lock it in. I used to like using it, but now I think sitting through with the arm bar is more effective.
      sigpic
      "No such thing as spare time, no such thing as free time, no such thing as down time...all you got is life time!"
      -Henry Rollins

      Comment


      • #4
        i appreciate hearing about this

        Originally posted by Mr. White View Post
        The third pic almost looks illegal. I used to use this a lot in high school, but I've had several refs stop the hold even though I kept it legal. Many of them didn't even know a fig 4 on the head is legal. Also, since you are parallel with the guy you are in dangerous trouble of getting rolled before you can lock it in. I used to like using it, but now I think sitting through with the arm bar is more effective.
        I dont see this move very much at all ... and was unaware that its legal...

        I see the ref blow the whistle alot when the wrestlers get vertical to the mat...and know my boy has been penalized too...for applying it when legs are in the air...

        Is the key to legal being parrell on the mat?

        When you lock it in are you squessing or pinching the head or neck?

        Who taught you the move? And how did you learn it?

        thx

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by AJP View Post
          I dont see this move very much at all ... and was unaware that its legal...

          I see the ref blow the whistle alot when the wrestlers get vertical to the mat...and know my boy has been penalized too...for applying it when legs are in the air...

          Is the key to legal being parrell on the mat?

          When you lock it in are you squessing or pinching the head or neck?

          Who taught you the move? And how did you learn it?

          thx
          The reason I say the third pic looks illegal is because his foot is down on the calf. It has to be behind the knee to be considered a figure 4. Figure 4 on the head can only be done from the top position, scissors are always illegal on the head. If you are not behind the knee it is considered scissors. Being parallel to the guy just makes it easier to get rolled. Once you have the figure 4 locked in, you should be safe, but in the process of trying to lock it in, a hard bridge from the bottom guy should easily roll the top guy. It doesn't choke or anything, it just lifts the head and the shoulder blades will go flat immediately. Once it is locked in, it is pretty much a guaranteed pin. I don't think anyone ever taught me the move, but I remember my high school coach telling me that a figure 4 on the head is legal in a pinning combo, so from there I just kind of figured it out.
          sigpic
          "No such thing as spare time, no such thing as free time, no such thing as down time...all you got is life time!"
          -Henry Rollins

          Comment


          • #6
            I tend to think younger wrestlers will do better with these walkover wings and one-on-ones. They are more gumby-like and able to sink the figure-four more easily without the risk of it going illegal. I used to use it a lot, along with the surfboard out of these grips and locks, but too tight is too tight. Being parallel is bad, but being so tight with this stuff allows the victim to push really hard at the right time and everything pops free.

            I know it pays to go slow on top if you plan to score, but getting this stuff right also requires careful adjustments throughout applying of the move by the older folk if wasted effort and PD is to be avoided.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by halfman View Post
              I tend to think younger wrestlers will do better with these walkover wings and one-on-ones. They are more gumby-like and able to sink the figure-four more easily without the risk of it going illegal. I used to use it a lot, along with the surfboard out of these grips and locks, but too tight is too tight. Being parallel is bad, but being so tight with this stuff allows the victim to push really hard at the right time and everything pops free.

              I know it pays to go slow on top if you plan to score, but getting this stuff right also requires careful adjustments throughout applying of the move by the older folk if wasted effort and PD is to be avoided.
              I agree, technique must be impeccable. Our 12 and 35 pounders use it a lot. but they can't get it on everybody.

              Comment


              • #8
                It's not usually a "go-to" move. We stop it often for illegal or potentially dangerous (usually a PD), mostly because kids suck at putting it in.

                The figure four to the head is only legal when someone on top does it. It cannot be put in from the neutral position. This usually happens when a kid shoots a low double, is dropped to his knees, and picks up the wrestler from his knees, putting the opponent's feet in the air. If he puts the figure four in, it's a technical violation, if he scissors the HEAD, I believe it's an immediate stoppage and penalty.

                Comment


                • #9
                  ok... thanks

                  Originally posted by NIref View Post
                  It's not usually a "go-to" move. We stop it often for illegal or potentially dangerous (usually a PD), mostly because kids suck at putting it in.

                  The figure four to the head is only legal when someone on top does it. It cannot be put in from the neutral position. This usually happens when a kid shoots a low double, is dropped to his knees, and picks up the wrestler from his knees, putting the opponent's feet in the air. If he puts the figure four in, it's a technical violation, if he scissors the HEAD, I believe it's an immediate stoppage and penalty.
                  i presume your an ihsa ref? thx

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by NIref View Post
                    It's not usually a "go-to" move. We stop it often for illegal or potentially dangerous (usually a PD), mostly because kids suck at putting it in.

                    The figure four to the head is only legal when someone on top does it. It cannot be put in from the neutral position. This usually happens when a kid shoots a low double, is dropped to his knees, and picks up the wrestler from his knees, putting the opponent's feet in the air. If he puts the figure four in, it's a technical violation, if he scissors the HEAD, I believe it's an immediate stoppage and penalty.
                    IF you have the arm in the fig-4 when neutral it is then legal right?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Under no circumstances can the figure four to the head be put in from neutral. That includes the drape with the arm.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by NIref View Post
                        It's not usually a "go-to" move. We stop it often for illegal or potentially dangerous (usually a PD), mostly because kids suck at putting it in.

                        The figure four to the head is only legal when someone on top does it. It cannot be put in from the neutral position. This usually happens when a kid shoots a low double, is dropped to his knees, and picks up the wrestler from his knees, putting the opponent's feet in the air. If he puts the figure four in, it's a technical violation, if he scissors the HEAD, I believe it's an immediate stoppage and penalty.
                        Actually, you are incorrect to say that it is only legal when someone on top does it. The bottom wrestler can also put it in and not get penalized. Think of it this way. Often we see the top wrestler drop down to a single to return the bottom guy to the mat after he attempts a stand up. The top wrestler remains in control while he is on the leg and should not get warned for stalling as long as he is working to improve, i.e. working to remain in control. Should he get his head buried on the inside (between the defensive wrestlers leg) while still maintaining control of the leg he may attempt to lift the defensive wrestler. The defensive wrestler then could figure four the head and not get penalized.

                        You did mention correctly that the figure four is a technical violation from the neutral position. The neutral position is the only place that a figure four would result in a TV.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          does anyone on your team use the move?

                          Originally posted by rasslcub View Post
                          anybody else out there love to use this hold? I find it very effective to pin

                          looking for thoughts/ideas about the hold... I've never had the hold applied to me.... so anybody on the receiving end can add to discussion...

                          does your team coaches teach the hold and actively encourage it? do any of your team members use the hold as well?
                          We have a young lady on our team that uses the figure 4 with the wing very effectively. She has pinned alot of the young men with it...
                          believing in ones self is winning in and of itself

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Big Ten Network

                            Niko Triggas the 125lber at Ohio State has used it twice in the past 2 weeks, to secure 2 falls...Both televised...Im sure you can youtube those, as they were both done very effectively.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Brandon Giletine From Peotone Has Used This Hold In Most Of His Matches But He Has Many Other Moves Too
                              Phoenix From Peotone

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