Stalling in the post-season

[petersenkid2]

The push out rule would kill folk style wrestling. First problem how do you score it when a kid on bottom stands up and is trying to get away and goes out of bounds?

Why would a kid who is on his feet and trying to get away go out of bounds?
Once you're on your feet, you're practically already away!

If you watch enough of the international styles closely - say, 1,000 matches or so - you would be surprised at how infrequently they go out of bounds on their feet. It's amazing! As soon as the official says "zone", they develop "stay in bounds superpowers".

You know what? It's just like in Folkstyle when I tell the wrestlers that the next time someone goes out of bounds, I'm calling stalling or a flee, all of a sudden, they magically become able to stay in, where they were having so much difficulty doing so before. I can say this with a great degree of certitude... One fleeing the mat call = 1 yelling coach (yelling at his wrestler to stay in, if he agreed with the call, and yelling at me if he didn't) and at least 10 fewer out of bounds calls over the course of the next few matches.

[WRFAN99]

The push out rule would kill folk style wrestling. First problem how do you score it when a kid on bottom stands up and is trying to get away and goes out of bounds? What if he gets out on edge then pushed out? Is that 1-1? don't tell me to get my stand up and escape in the center, if you think you can do that every time your a freak athlete or never wrestled. The styles with the push out don't have stand ups and escapes on edge. Second and bigger problem is the sport would change from offense on feet, to push but don't shoot. I would hate to be a heavyweight who weights 235. That rule would be worse for wrestling then dropping the 135 class for another big guy class. Fix stalling but not with a push out.

[Assembly of Dust]

Why can't the edge just be out of bounds? Period.

Simple.

Just like FS/GR and every other sport in existence.

Edge wrestling in folkstyle sucks. It just gives guys who are unwilling or unable to compete an opportunity to win.

The edge was great in college until this year. You can pin a guy out of bounds, love it! The stall rule they made is so stupid!

[Nelson*0.5]

What is even worse regarding edge calls is when the defensive guy - the guy not being offensive and taking risk is rewarded on a call that could go either way.
This is where common sense comes in to play where you would hope officials are looking to reward the attacker.

Personally, I am a big fan of attacking on the edge and perfecting the skills to score on the edge. That's much different than "playing the edge". I am not a fan of wrestlers who play the edge as a means to give themselves an out if they begin to get in trouble. However, taking a chance on the edge that will likely only resort in points is a great risk and one I will always encourage and support.

[Kurt Angle]

Worse

Why can't the edge just be out of bounds? Period.

Simple.

Just like FS/GR and every other sport in existence.

Edge wrestling in folkstyle sucks. It just gives guys who are unwilling or unable to compete an opportunity to win.

What is even worse regarding edge calls is when the defensive guy - the guy not being offensive and taking risk is rewarded on a call that could go either way.
This is where common sense comes in to play where you would hope officials are looking to reward the attacker.

[Red Turban]

Why can't the edge just be out of bounds? Period.

Simple.

Just like FS/GR and every other sport in existence.

Edge wrestling in folkstyle sucks. It just gives guys who are unwilling or unable to compete an opportunity to win.

[Clarion167]

Agree!

The out of bounds stalling rules are a mess in college. Not only is it not called consistently from ref to ref but too often not called consistently by the same ref within a single match. I don't blame the refs for this because the rule is dumb.

I agree- very inconsistent calls in college. Watch for this one to be changed for next year or at the very least better clarified to assist the officials. I'm not is favor...

[PapaBearSLIM]

One point for push out. Put people on their feet when nothing is happening on the mat. Forget about stalling altogether. And please don't adopt the college stalling rules. What a mess that would be. Might be doable for high level officials at the college level, but for the average high school official, this level of specificity on stalling would be an utter nightmare.

The out of bounds stalling rules are a mess in college. Not only is it not called consistently from ref to ref but too often not called consistently by the same ref within a single match. I don't blame the refs for this because the rule is dumb.

[Nelson*0.5]

I think The way the pushout rule is now, in FS and GR, is that a wrestler cannot just push a guy out with his arms extended, he must be in control of his opponent when both wrestlers go out.

Correct. It did not make much of a difference when they made that clarification. Just eliminated those blatant situations where one guy was trying to do was push his opponent out.

[inpain]

Here is why I really don't like it. My brother and I were watching one of his high school matches. (actually a state finals match)

He choose down. Got to his feet quickly, did a cut through for an escape and then his opponent pushed him out of bounds. My brother was awarded a point. With the push out rule, his opponent would now get a point as well. That would be just dumb? Don't you think.

I think The way the pushout rule is now, in FS and GR, is that a wrestler cannot just push a guy out with his arms extended, he must be in control of his opponent when both wrestlers go out.

[petersenkid2]

When somebody posts: "That's the rule", they should also include the rule and article number from the rule book or from the case book and manual. Otherwise they should post: "I think that's the rule".

[refsforfun]

Consistency

You should see consistency all the time with this as it is discussed at all official clinics, rules interpretation meetings, and before the regionals start.

But the correction needed to be made is that it is two times it should be stopped as potentially dangerous (after he comes to his feet) then a stalling call. If he is still in the tripod position on the mat it's just like the legs are in and he's on the mat and you shouldn't call it any different in the tripod position as if they were on the mat. The only time it becomes potentially dangerous is when he comes all the way up to his feet.

[Assembly of Dust]

Here is why I really don't like it. My brother and I were watching one of his high school matches. (actually a state finals match)

He choose down. Got to his feet quickly, did a cut through for an escape and then his opponent pushed him out of bounds. My brother was awarded a point. With the push out rule, his opponent would now get a point as well. That would be just dumb? Don't you think.

[Seconds Count]

What about stalling when a wrestler tripods up with the legs in?

The push out rule is subjective, but I have seen several matches this season where the top wrestler puts the legs in and the bottom wrestler "tripods" up and the ref calls potential danger and they are back to referee's position. The rule is that a wrestler can tripod up 1 time and if he does it again (2nd time) you get hit with stalling on the bottom - that's the rule.

I have seen several matches where the bottom wrestler tripods up multiple times without getting hit for stalling. I spoke to a few very good refs and they confirmed that it's one time and you get hit with stalling on the second tripod - up - hard set rule. Who else out there see's this happening? I have seen it several times this year - seems like it's a rule but the refs aren't calling it. I hope we see some more consistency with this in the state tournament.

[Tiger Pride]

Okay then

That explains a lot about why we see things differently. I do understand your perspective. I hate folkstyle, like freestyle a little better, and absolutely love Greco. That should explain my perspective to you. You sound like a good guy. We just value different aspects of the sport.