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-   -   Impeachment: Call to order! (http://illinoismatmen.com/forum/showthread.php?t=67062)

MAL 10-27-2019 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefIllini1 (Post 556925)
According to the Washington Post, Ambassador to the EU Gordon Sondland told the Impeachment committees that it was a quid pro quo.

Ergo, Gordon Sondland:

(A) ... was joking.
(B) ... is part of the "deep state."
(C) ... was only a coffee boy.
(D) ... was exactly right because quid pro quos are just the bestest now since everbody does them all the time, and if a president does one involving personal political interests and taxpayer money it can't be a crime, and even if it was a crime, it doesn't amount to sufficient reason to remove a president. And Hillary Clinton's emails.

Gordon Sondland won't be in the news cycle as long as the "whistleblower"

The definition of high crimes and misdemeanors is: What ever the Speaker of the house says it is. There is no definition offered by the framers of the Constitution.

Conviction in the Senate requires the will of the people, because these Senators will have to answer to their constituents about how they voted. Any crime is literally irrelevant to the process...it shouldn't be, but it it is.

I have heard it argued that quid pro quo is basically how most foreign policy is conducted. We generally have conditions that must be met before we hand out foreign aid.

You forgot to mention Quid Pro Joe.

ChiefIllini1 10-28-2019 05:36 AM

Article of Impeachment #9: Conspiracy

Any crime that involved more than one person almost certainly raises the specter of criminal liability for conspiracy. Not collusion. Conspiracy. The federal statute for conspiracy provides:

Quote:

If two or more persons conspire either to commit any offense against the United States, or to defraud the United States, or any agency thereof in any manner or for any purpose, and one or more of such persons do any act to effect the object of the conspiracy, each shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years, or both.
18 U.S.C. § 371. Trump is all but convicted of two conspiracies involving Michael Cohen and David Pecker of the National Enquirer. Both of those cases relate to conspiracies to commit campaign finance violations against the United States, and we know that in both cases payments were made, so there was at least “one act to effect the object of the conspiracy.”


Additionally, Trump was involved in a conspiracy to fire FBI Director Comey, which was an obstruction of justice. Mueller's report documents that conspiracy, which involved AG Sessions and Assistant AG Rosenstein. Finally, there were the machinations involved in putting constant pressure on Ukraine to do the president's political bidding. Giuliani, Sondland and whomever hid the actual transcript in the secret server were involved in that conspiracy. Trump is implicated in the conspiracy because of his telephone call with the Ukrainian President.

ChiefIllini1 11-09-2019 09:44 AM

.
TWO QUESTIONS FOR THE BOARD

1. If you were lead House counsel working on Impeachment would you advise the Democrats to include, as an Article of Impeachment, Trump's embezzlement from Charity?

2. Republicans have not come out strongly and urgently in favor of impeachment and removal yet even though the evidence is overwhelming. Is it because they are just as creeped out by Pence as we are?

Please show your work in your answers. Thank you.

oldpioneer 11-09-2019 10:48 AM

Read the transcript! It was perfect!

ChiefIllini1 11-09-2019 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldpioneer (Post 557042)
Read the transcript! It was perfect!

As usual, you are right, oldpioneer. That transcript perfectly accounts for every element in the federal bribery statute, it establishes extortion and the violation of campaign finance laws. It is a perfect example of an Abuse of Power under the Constitution because of the self-dealing and the usurpation of Congress' power of the purse. These perfect words will live in infamy:

Quote:

I would like you to do us a favor though....
After Trump's henchmen put months of pressure on Ukraine, Trump could have said nothing except congratulations and come see me in the White House. But instead, he gave us the perfect transcript.

This was like in the movies when the FBI is listening to the wiretap tapes, and suddenly the targeted criminal implicates himself. The FBI agents look at each other in amazement, and one of them pulls out a cigarette, lights it and says, "perfect."

MAL 11-10-2019 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefIllini1 (Post 557041)
.
TWO QUESTIONS FOR THE BOARD

1. If you were lead House counsel working on Impeachment would you advise the Democrats to include, as an Article of Impeachment, Trump's embezzlement from Charity?

2. Republicans have not come out strongly and urgently in favor of impeachment and removal yet even though the evidence is overwhelming. Is it because they are just as creeped out by Pence as we are?

Please show your work in your answers. Thank you.

Yes, by all means include embezzlement...but the big one that you are forgetting about is spitting on the sidewalk. It is a little known fact the spitting on the sidewalk is an impeachable offence, and I saw him do it at an event in Iowa. I wish we could impeach him for deficit spending.

I think the Republicans in the Senate would prefer Pence over Trump, but they are stuck with Trump because Trump has about a 90% approval rating with Republican voters.

Impeachment is not a criminal or civil trial. It is a political trial...therefore any alleged crimes, (real or perceived) are 100% irrelevant to the process because the jury wants to get re-elected.

Nancy will not even start the impeachment process because:

1. There is not enough time before the election.

2. Sitting senators are not allowed to run for President during an impeachment. As soon as Nancy handed the ball to Mitch McConnell, Mitch would sit on the ball and run out the clock if the Democrat nominee was a Senator.

3. During an impeachment Trumps legal team could call and question witnesses. Witness number one would be Eric Ciaramella, also known as the whistleblower. Democrats do not want him questioned!

4. Trump is more popular than you are led to believe. There has never been a poll that has accurately predicted Trump. Trump has beat every polls expectations.

mooseknuckle 11-11-2019 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefIllini1 (Post 557041)
.
Is it because they are just as creeped out by Pence as we are?

Creeped out by Pence?

Are you serious? But you're okay with Biden pawing his way through women and children across America? So you just want to be a partisan hack and then tell everyone else what they're doing wrong? LOL.

Thanks for the reminder why I mostly ignore your nonsense. This one just got me.

Why any sane fan of the Illini (or Batman for that matter) tolerates your blathering is beyond me. You do far more to hurt the cause than help it. Just my opinion.

ChiefIllini1 11-12-2019 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mooseknuckle (Post 557077)
Creeped out by Pence?

Are you serious?

The Hoosier Mortician is creepy.

He calls his wife "Mother," and he won't be in a room alone with another woman. I can imagine Pence hitting the button on his inter-office intercom in a panic, almost out of breath, "Margaret, send in some men ASAP!" He looks more like a Bond villain than any past or current Bond villains. Is he supposed to be Ernst Stavro Blofeld from Diamonds Are Forever or the creepy platinum top SPECTRE hitman in From Russia with Love?

Mike Pence is stiffer than a 17-year old at his first stag party. To top it off, the creepiest dude in the world, Stephen King, thinks that Mike Pence is creepy (true fact). That's like C. Montgomery Burns saying about the Devil:

Quote:

Who's that goat-legged fellow? I like the cut of his jib.
You know that Pence was selected for the VP position by Paul Manafort, right? The same Paul Manafort in prison right now. The same Paul Manafort who gave polling data to a Russian agent. The guy who was an unlicensed foreign agent while also acting as Trump's Campaign Manager.

Mike Pence is creepy like a movie about exorcism. Mike Pence is creepy like a half-a-bug in your half-eaten sandwich. Mike Pence is creepy like an abandoned barn. Mike Pence is creepy.

ChiefIllini1 11-12-2019 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAL (Post 557068)
Yes, by all means include embezzlement...but the big one that you are forgetting about is spitting on the sidewalk. It is a little known fact the spitting on the sidewalk is an impeachable offence, and I saw him do it at an event in Iowa. I wish we could impeach him for deficit spending.

Senator Mal, there is a difference between embezzlement and spitting on a sidewalk or deficit spending. One of those things is an impeachable offense.

I think the Republicans in the Senate would prefer Pence over Trump, but they are stuck with Trump because Trump has about a 90% approval rating with Republican voters.

That percentage will be interesting to keep track of as the Impeachment hearings go public.

Impeachment is not a criminal or civil trial. It is a political trial...therefore any alleged crimes, (real or perceived) are 100% irrelevant to the process because the jury wants to get re-elected.

There are some Republicans who may do their duty. We shall see, Brother Mal.

Beginning tomorrow, all bets are off. I hope one of the House counsel handling the questioning is Barry Berke. He's a buzzsaw.

ChiefIllini1 11-12-2019 09:06 PM

In my haste, I neglected to mention the creepiest aspect of creepy Mike Pence: He is supposed to be some kind of believer in God. Yet, without qualm he sold his soul to the crimey-est, most immoral, vulgar, bearing-false-witness-and-*****-grabbing devil to occupy a political office in our great country. And to watch the glowing look of approval on creepy Mike Pence's face while he looks at Trump blubbering through a mangled defense of this crime or that sin like he's watching Jesus feed an entire wedding party with $3.50 and an expired Poppa John's coupon creeps me out like I just saw dead people, and those dead people talked to me as if they weren't dead, but they were very much dead.

I apologize for this lapse. Mike Pence is creepy.


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