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  • Gun Control

    Now. Not soon. Now.

  • #2
    Originally posted by ChiefIllini1 View Post
    Now. Not soon. Now.
    Not gun control, people control.
    "I wouldn't give a hoot in hell for a man who lost and laughed!" Gen. George Patton

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    • #3
      Ban video games?
      Always support your local wrestling tournament concession stands!!!

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      • #4
        and the low rated, Fake news, CNN is out there photo shopping videos. The president said his heart is with the people of Toledo! They posted other clips from his rallies of other things he said and I know they are all fake!
        Always support your local wrestling tournament concession stands!!!

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        • #5
          A few points. First of all, regardless of WTF Trump said, a mature, rational, SANE person doesn't take a semi-automatic rifle...and that's what it was, NOT an "assault rifle", and shoot innocent people. Period. Secondly, given the shooter's mental health history he should not have been able to purchase or own a firearm; here in Illinois he would have been immediately flagged. Go back a few years to the Texas church shooter; had the Texas State Police had his Bad Conduct discharge from the Air Force for felony spousal abuse HE would not have been able to own a firearm legally. Here in Illinois a few years ago the Red Flag bill passed here in Illinois...the first edition was terrible but the ISRA (Illinois State Rifle Association) worked with a bi-partisan committee and passed a common sense Red Flag Law. The only flaw in the system comes when things aren't reported, because the Illinois State Police files for both FOID and CCL are updated DAILY. I would also point out that a few years ago a Sun Times reporter was trying to do an expose on how easy it was to purchase a firearm, and went to Maxons, a gun shop and indoor range I go to often, and tried to purchase a firearm. He failed the background check when an assault charge showed up and was denied the purchase. We have laws that work when the proper information is shared and the laws are enforced.
          sigpic


          "On the bloody morning after, one tin soldier rides away..."

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          • #6
            Give Trump a break. MASH is one of his favorite shows and the Mudhens are his favorite minor league team.

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            • #7
              Enough talking about states! We need a national database. That means if you want to buy a firearm youíre gonna put your Social Security down and be known nationwide! A $15 Illinois fishing license requires it. When I was reluctant to give it to a 16-year-old kid at a sporting good store I was informed it is to chase down dead beat dads . I said now thatís an idea! And gladly give it out every year.

              Man you can call that gun whatever you want if the cops took him out in one minute and he got something like 30 - 40 rounds off you call it a squirt gun as far as Iím concerned.

              You donít have to tell me about Texas I lived there and taught Texas history I know the law. Real far right Texans donít even think they should have anything to do with the United States of America.

              Iím surprised you didnít drop the obvious go to phrase. There are killings in Chicago and Illinois has the strict gun laws. I got one word for you, Indiana!

              Donít worry though, you guys can continue to buy and sell guns online cross state borders and all that. Because for the Republican Party, money trumps lives!

              Do you know the definition of insanity? I got news for you, according to the American psychological Association, Osama bin Laden was not mentally ill. Political and racial extremist are not mentally ill. However, they can be led to follow. And the President of the United States has, arguably, the biggest megaphone in the world. Donít think of this as something about you and I Think about billions of people. I will ask you this, do you think trumps words at rallies have contributed in someway to the rise in white supremacists?
              Always support your local wrestling tournament concession stands!!!

              Comment


              • #8
                Here’s another state fact for you. If you are back on child support and all that Illinois chasing you around, just move to Texas. They cannot garnish wages in anyway shape or form. They can also not seize his property that is used to make money. So if I do construction or I am in a band, they can’t touch my tools or instruments!

                The framers put provisions for states for good reason. Hunting varies from state to state. I don’t think I will be using my saltwater fishing license anytime soon in Illinois . Chains on tires are completely legal in Utah with good reason. When Gun owners resist federal registration, license, background checks, it makes me think they have something to hide. So Mack, my dear friend, and in my opinion, a lawful and safe going on or, what say you? You ready to put your name and all your credentials and a federal database? I never met the family stuff to be personal. But it is true.
                Last edited by oldpioneer; 08-05-2019, 06:01 PM.
                Always support your local wrestling tournament concession stands!!!

                Comment


                • #9
                  I don't have a dog in this fight but of the last 88 shooters who were tabulated & met that criteria, only 14.8 percent had been diagnosed with a psychotic disorder. And even for them, it’s hard to say with any certainty that mental illness caused or contributed to their shooting.

                  The US does not have more crazy people and we already lock up more people than anyone. Its not like there are other countries with hunting and legal guns that we can compare to, which is a shame because that might be helpful. It is possible the 2nd Amendment was meant as a suicide pact, and if that is the cost of freedom we should live with it. As for Trump naming video games and not the real reason that statisticians have found is for entertainment only. We have had 249 mass shootings this year compared to the next country at 3, but they up'd the count required so officially we are at 130. I see arguments on both sides of this one, but the American way is for the majority of the cost of the deaths to be distributed upon the gun owners via tax. The 55 people shot every weekend in the summer should be of some concern to the locals you might think. I went to NIU, we had a mass shooting there & then just this year an intern from NIU was shot in a mass shooting, that one seemed a bit personal. These cases proved the good guy with a gun argue null as well, 9 people in 32 seconds.

                  I called this situation in the other thread about two weeks ago, it was inevitable.
                  There are two guys in that zebra costume! Very funny...

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by oldpioneer View Post
                    Ban video games?
                    He did not say ban video games and you know it. I have read stories about how the military uses violent video games to desensitize the troops so that they are more comfortable killing people.

                    I think it is important to discuss what societal changes have caused the increase in mass shootings We did not have video games with rape and murder in them when we were kids...but they do now.

                    Mass shootings are in bold because the last time I checked violent crime went down at the same time that gun ownership went up.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by oldpioneer View Post
                      Here’s another state fact for you. If you are back on child support and all that Illinois chasing you around, just move to Texas. They cannot garnish wages in anyway shape or form. They can also not seize his property that is used to make money. So if I do construction or I am in a band, they can’t touch my tools or instruments!

                      The framers put provisions for states for good reason. Hunting varies from state to state. I don’t think I will be using my saltwater fishing license anytime soon in Illinois . Chains on tires are completely legal in Utah with good reason. When Gun owners resist federal registration, license, background checks, it makes me think they have something to hide. So Mack, my dear friend, and in my opinion, a lawful and safe going on or, what say you? You ready to put your name and all your credentials and a federal database? I never met the family stuff to be personal. But it is true.
                      How is Mack putting his name on a national Data base going to make anybody safer? Why are you focusing on punishing the good guy with a gun? Both of these last two shootings were stopped by a good guy with a gun, but you don't seem to care if the bad guys have guns.

                      The entire purpose of the second amendment was to protect us from the federal government...there was absolutely no mention of hunting. If you give the Federal government a list of gun owners...that list will be abused in any way possible. Remember the IRS targeting the Tea Party. Do you realize the governments of the world are responsible for all of the worst mass shootings...all of these shootings that spark this gun debate over and over would not even make the list of worst mass shootings...not including war...and you want to trust them with a list of gun owners.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by MAL View Post
                        He did not say ban video games and you know it. I have read stories about how the military uses violent video games to desensitize the troops so that they are more comfortable killing people.

                        I think it is important to discuss what societal changes have caused the increase in mass shootings We did not have video games with rape and murder in them when we were kids...but they do now.

                        Mass shootings are in bold because the last time I checked violent crime went down at the same time that gun ownership went up.
                        I did not say he said ban video games, he named them as a contributing issue. Video games are all over the world & more popular in Asia than here, this issue is mainly unique to the US in frequency. (The most violent video game of all - Mortal Combat - developed at our U of I notably.) The Statisticians say the one unique variable about the US and this issue is the sheer number of guns (plus type I assume) compared to other countries. The sensible thing to do is look at countries that have hunting etc and less shooting. But this is the US, we do our own thing. I do not see this being resolved, mass shootings will likely increase, it will continue as a price of freedom. You aren't going to "fix or control" the people, that is ridiculous. As they say in the jungle, eat what the monkeys eat. We know what works elsewhere - its not going to happen here, might as well move on to climate change - that will be easier.

                        The last Illinois mass shooting case was more disturbing, an ex-con applied for a concealed carry license for his guns. So the police knew an ex-con prohibited from owning guns had them. They do not go get them, that is what they said. Part of owning a gun should be going in large groups with guns with the police to go get these guns from those that the police say are too dangerous to go get. Or just get them by surprise. I never heard the reason, but it is likely a common issue.

                        I think it is a bad idea to say if you own guns or not, just like it is a bad idea to post vacation photos while on vacation.
                        Last edited by Blonjuan44; 08-06-2019, 04:48 PM.
                        There are two guys in that zebra costume! Very funny...

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Colion Noir with an excellent take on gun deaths:

                          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8c2wKISv0o

                          Oh and my Social Security number goes on both the FOID and CCL license applications.

                          Here is the ATF Form 4473, REQUIRED for firearm purchases. Even if I purchase a firearm online, I have to fill out the paperwork and have it delivered to an FFL dealer.

                          https://www.atf.gov/firearms/atf-for...cord-revisions


                          Mack
                          Last edited by mckbln; 08-06-2019, 03:12 PM.
                          sigpic


                          "On the bloody morning after, one tin soldier rides away..."

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by mckbln View Post
                            Colion Noir with an excellent take on gun deaths:

                            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8c2wKISv0o

                            Oh and my Social Security number goes on both the FOID and CCL license applications.

                            Here is the ATF Form 4473, REQUIRED for firearm purchases. Even if I purchase a firearm online, I have to fill out the paperwork and have it delivered to an FFL dealer.

                            https://www.atf.gov/firearms/atf-for...cord-revisions


                            Mack
                            I don't think anybody cares, but SSN is optional - it is stated right there on Question 8 that it is optional on sheet you attached. But who cares? it is also up to who is selling it because some computer programs don't allow blank fields. How paranoid would somebody have to be not to provide their SSN, but the gun lobby has kept it optional. Most of the guns in these mass shootings are legal anyway. And most guns on the south side of Chicago come from Indiana. Shootings of all types are simply part of the American culture now, not great for tourism - although the odds are incredibly slim.
                            There are two guys in that zebra costume! Very funny...

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Blonjuan44 View Post
                              I did not say he said ban video games, he named them as a contributing issue. Video games are all over the world & more popular in Asia than here, this issue is mainly unique to the US in frequency. (The most violent video game of all - Mortal Combat - developed at our U of I notably.) The Statisticians say the one unique variable about the US and this issue is the sheer number of guns (plus type I assume) compared to other countries. The sensible thing to do is look at countries that have hunting etc and less shooting. But this is the US, we do our own thing. I do not see this being resolved, mass shootings will likely increase, it will continue as a price of freedom. You aren't going to "fix or control" the people, that is ridiculous. As they say in the jungle, eat what the monkeys eat. We know what works elsewhere - its not going to happen here, might as well move on to climate change - that will be easier.

                              The last Illinois mass shooting case was more disturbing, an ex-con applied for a concealed carry license for his guns. So the police knew an ex-con prohibited from owning guns had them. They do not go get them, that is what they said. Part of owning a gun should be going in large groups with guns with the police to go get these guns from those that the police say are too dangerous to go get. Or just get them by surprise. I never heard the reason, but it is likely a common issue.

                              I think it is a bad idea to say if you own guns or not, just like it is a bad idea to post vacation photos while on vacation.

                              The stats that you have been quoting are bogus and misleading. There have not been 249 mass shootings this year. It is not even close to that, its probably under 10. They changed the definition of mass shootings to get 249. Mass shootings are 4 dead or more, not counting the shooter. They played all kinds of tricks with the numbers. They counted shooting where nobody died...they included the shooter in the death toll...they added gang violence. Even politiFact doesn't wholeheartedly support that claim.


                              Nobody is proud of our death toll, but we are not even close to having the most gun violence in any category...maybe with the exception of Gun suicide.

                              This is from 2015 but it still has some relevance

                              https://fee.org/articles/the-myth-th...ass-shootings/


                              https://wjla.com/news/nation-world/m...ther-countries


                              https://nypost.com/2018/08/30/americ...ass-shootings/

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