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-   -   Impeachment: Call to order! (http://illinoismatmen.com/forum/showthread.php?t=67062)

MAL 10-15-2019 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crystal Clearly (Post 556799)
You are a completely brainwashed and utterly deranged fool.

In the first sentence of your reply you say you are not that motivated to defend Trump, yet you regurgitate debunked lie after debunked lie, conspiracy theory after conspiracy theory.
You twist, spin, deflect and deceive (mostly yourself).
Your posts are not based on actual fact, they are based on the "facts" that you find in baseless, obscure and unsubstantiated claims made by websites/blogs/podcasts that are not bound by fact, not regulated to research and report truth and are not held accountable for the garbage that they spew because they are not responsible for the people who are dumb enough to believe their garbage for being too stupid to know the difference.

With all of the spinning you do you cannot possibly keep food down. :rolleyes:

You offer no rational argument, no base for discussion, and no sense of decency that one should expect in a rat.
Your only purpose (or desire) is to confuse and divide and I will have nothing more to do with your agenda.

I'm done with you. :cool:

Again? We were just starting to have a nice discussion.

MAL 10-16-2019 01:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefIllini1 (Post 556781)
.
Article of Impeachment #7: Abuse of Power and a missed opportunity for justice

This was an article of impeachment in the matters involving both Nixon and Clinton. It is kind of a catch-all but for our purposes today, I will only deal with the Ukraine extortion.

CHARGE: It is alleged that Biden personally, and through various intermediaries, sought to condition loan guaranties for one billion dollars to Ukraine upon that country to fire the prosecutor that was investigating Hunter Biden's criminal enterprise.

EVIDENCE: There is a video of quid pro Joe saying so https://www.wsj.com/video/opinion-th...B665BD2BC.html

WHY THIS IS IMPORTANT: The matter is important because Trump is trying to get a foreign government to investigate political corruption at the highest levels of the United States government. Moreover, Biden did extort this foreign government for his personal financial ambitions. This is an obvious abuse of power.

We should read the entire conversation to avoid contextual misinterpretation. When you read the entire conversation it is easy to see why the DNC needed to change their Depends. The thing that really made them crap their pants was when Trump mentioned Crowdstrike. Crowdstrike is the company that investigated the DNC server hack, because they would not let the FBI look at it. Crowdstrike was co-founded by Dmitri Alperovitch(a Russian) The DNC hired a Russian to investigate their server hack after they told the FBI to get lost. Does that sound strange to you?


·UNCLASSIFIED

Declassified by order of the President'
September 24, 2019

MEMORANDUM OF TELEPHONE CONVERSATION
(C) Telephone Conversation with President Zelenskyy of Ukraine

Notetakers: The White House Situation·Room
July 25, 2019, 9:03 - 9:33 a.m. EDT

The President: Congratulations on a great victory. We all
watched from the United States and you did a terrific job. The
way you came from behind, somebody who wasn't given much of a
chance, and you ended up winning easily. It's a fantastic
achievement. Congratulations.

President Zelenskyy: You are absolutely right Mr.
Presideht. We did win big and we worked hard for this. We worked
a lot but I would like to confess to you that I had an
opportunity to learn from you. We used quite a few of your
skills and knowledge and were able to use it as an example for
our elections and yes it is true that these were unique
elections. We were in a unique situation that we were able to
achieve a unique success. I'm able to tell you the following;
the first time, you called me to congratulate me when I won my
presidential election, and the second time you are now calling
me when my party won the parliamentary election. I think I
should run more often so you can call me more often and we can
talk over the phone more often.

The President: [laughter] That's a very good idea. I
think your country is very happy about that.

President Zelenskyy: Well yes, to tell you the truth, we
are trying to work hard because we wanted to drain the swamp
here in our country. We brought in many many new people. Not the
old politicians, not the typical politicians, because we want to
have a new format and a new type of government. You are a great
teacher for us and in that.

The President: Well it is very nice of you to say that. I
will say that we do a lot for Ukraine. We spend a lot of effort
and a lot of time. Much more than the European countries are
doing and they should be helping you more than they are. Germany
does almost nothing for you. All they do is talk and I think
it's something that you should really ask them about. When I was
speaking to Angela Merkel she talks Ukraine, but she doesn't do
anything. A lot of the European countries are the same way so I
think it's something you want to look at but the United States
has been very very good to Ukraine. I wouldn't say that it's
reciprocal necessarily because things are happening that are not
good but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine.

President Zelenskyy: Yes you are absolutely right. not
only 100%, but actually 1000% and I can tell you the following;
I did talk to Angela Merkel and I did meet with her. I also met
and talked with Macron and I told them that they are not doing
quite as much as they need to be doing on the issues with the
sanctions. They are not enforcing the sanctions. They are not
working as much as they should work for Ukraine It turns out
that even though logically, the European Union should be our
biggest partner but technically the United States is a much
bigger partner than the European Union and I'm very grateful to
you for that because the United States is doing quite a lot for
Ukraine. Much more than the European Union especially when we
are talking about sanctions against the Russian Federation I would also like to thank you for your great support in the area of defense. We are ready to continue to cooperate for the next steps. specifically we are almost ready to buy more Javelins from the United States for defense purposes

The President: I would like you to do us a favor though
because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a
lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with
this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike ... I guess
you have one of your wealthy people. The server, they say
Ukraine has it There are a lot of things that went on, the
whole situation I think you are surrounding yourself with some
of the same people. I would like to have the Attorney General
call you or your people and I would like you to get to the
bottom of it. As you say yesterday, that whole nonsense ended
with a very poor performance by a man named Robert Mueler, an
incompetent performance but they say a lot of it started with
Ukraine. Whatever you can do, it's very important that you do it
if that's possible.

President Zelenskyy: Yes it is very important for me and
everything that you just mentioned earlier. For me as a
President, it is very important and we are open for any future
cooperation. We are ready to open a new page on cooperation in
relations between the United States and Ukraine. For that
purpose, I just recalled our ambassador from United States and
he will be replaced by a very competent and very experienced
ambassador who will work hard on making sure that our two
nations are getting closer. I would also like and hope to see
him having your trust and your confidence and have personal
relations with you so we can cooperate even more so I will
personally tell you that one of my assistants spoke with Mr.
Giuliani just recently and we are hoping very much that Mr.
Giuliani will be able to travel to Ukraine and we will meet once he comes to Ukraine. I just wanted to assure you once again that
you have nobody but friends around us. I will make sure that I
surround myself with the best and most experienced people. I
also wanted to tell you that we are friends. We are great
friends and you Mr. President have friends in our country so we
can continue our strategic partnership. I also plan to surround
myself with great people and in addition to that investigation,
I guarantee as the President of Ukraine that all the
investigations will be done openly and candidly. That I can
assure you.

The President: Good because I heard you had a prosecutor
who was very good and he was shut down and that's really unfair.
A lot of people are talking about that, the way they shut your
very good prosecutor down and you had some very bad people
involved. Mr. Giuliani is a highly respected man. He was the_
mayor bf New York City, a great mayor, and I would like him to
call you. I will ask him to call you along with the Attorney General.
Rudy very much knows what's happening and he is a very
capable guy. If you could speak to him that would be great. The
former ambassador from the United States, the woman was bad
news and the people she was dealing with in the Ukraine were bad
news so I just want to let you know that. The other thing,
There's a lot of talk about Biden's son, that Biden stopped the
prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so
whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great.
Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if
you can look into it. It sounds horrible to me.

President Zelenskyy: I wanted to tell you about the
prosecutor First of all I understand and I'm knowledgeable
about the situation. Since we have won the absolute majority in
our Parliament. the next prosecutor general will be 100% my
person, my candidate, who will be approved, by the parliament and
will start. as a new prosecutor in September. He or she will look.
into the situation, specifically to the company that you
mentioned in this issue. The issue of the investigation of the
case is actually the issue of making sure to resolve the honesty
so we will take care of that and will work on the investigation
of the case. On top of that, I would kindly ask you if you have
any additional information that you can provide to µs, it would_
be very helpful for the investigation to make sure that we
administer justice in our country with regard to the Ambassador
to the United States from Ukraine as far as I recall her name
was Ivanovicli. It was great that you were the first one. who told
me that she was a bad ambassador because I agree·with you 100%.
Her attitude towards me was far from the best as she admired the
previous President and she was on his side. She would not accept
me as a new President well enough.

The President: Well, she' s going to go through some
things. I will. have Mr. Giuliani give you a call and I am also
going to have Attorney General Barr call and we will get to the
bottom of it. I'm sure you will figure it out. I heard the
prosecutor was treated very badly and he was a very fair
prosecutor so good luck with everything. Your economy is going
to get better and better I predict. You have a lot of assets.
It's a great country. I have many Ukrainian friends, their
incredible people.

President Zelenskyy: I would like to tell you that I also
have.quite a few Ukrainian friends that live in the United
States. Actually last time I traveled to the United States, I
stayed in New York near Central Park and I stayed at the Trump Tower. I will talk to them and I hope to see them again in the future. I also wanted to
thank you for your invitation to visit the United States, specifically Washington DC. On the other hand, I also want to ensure you that we will. be very serious about the case and will work on the investigation. As to the
economy, there is much potential for our two countries and one
of the issues that is very important for Ukraine is energy
independence. I believe we can be very successful and
cooperating on energy independence with United States. We are
already working on cooperation. We are buying American oil but I
am very hopeful for a future meeting. We will have more time and
more opportunity to discuss these opportunities and get to
know each other better. I would like to thank you very much for
your support.

The President: Good, well thank you very much and I
appreciate that. I will tell Rudy and Attorney General Barr to call. Thank you. Whenever you would like to come to the White House feel free to call. Give us a date and we'll work that out. I look forward to seeing you.

President Zelenskyy: Thank you very much. I would be very
happy to come and would be happy to meet with you personally and I
get to know you better. I am looking forward to our meeting and
I also would like to invite you to visit Ukraine and come to the
city bf Kyiv which is a beautiful city. We have a beautiful
country Which would welcome you. On the other hand, I believe
that on September l we will be in Poland and we can meet in
Poland hopefully. After that, it might be a very good idea for
you to travel to Ukraine. We can either take my plane and go to
Ukraine or we can take your plane, which is probably much better
than mine.

The President: Okay, we can work that out. I look forward
to seeing you in Washington and maybe in Poland because I think
we are going to be there at that time.

President · Zelenskyy: Thank you very much Mr. President.

The President: Congratulations on a fantastic job you've
done. The whole world was watching. I'm not sure it was so much
of an upset but congratulations.

President Zelenskyy: Thank you Mr. President bye bye .

Blonjuan44 10-16-2019 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAL (Post 556805)

President Zelenskyy: Thank you Mr. President bye-bye .

Who cares about Biden? he is not the President. Huge difference. The Reps keep saying "but other people were bad too" - that does not work. Biden won't even be the nominee. He referred to a record player - ouch. Its great that he was though, because he caused a huge unforced error. President Trump keeps talking about other people who should be impeached when he is the only one who can. I hope he keeps talking about Hillary more, that really matters currently. They say this is the payoff that Russia wanted, might just be a coincidence.

MAL 10-16-2019 11:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blonjuan44 (Post 556812)
Who cares about Biden? he is not the President. Huge difference. The Reps keep saying "but other people were bad too" - that does not work. Biden won't even be the nominee. He referred to a record player - ouch. Its great that he was though, because he caused a huge unforced error. President Trump keeps talking about other people who should be impeached when he is the only one who can. I hope he keeps talking about Hillary more, that really matters currently. They say this is the payoff that Russia wanted, might just be a coincidence.

The call had very little to do with Biden. The first thing that Trump mentioned was Crowdstrike, and then the Ambassador to the Ukraine. That Ambassador gave a long list of people that she did not want prosecuted to the Ukrainian authorities...and she just testified to congress in the impeachment inquiry. What Joe and Hunter were doing may not even be illegal, but it was corrupt and unethical.

Blonjuan44 10-17-2019 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAL (Post 556813)
The call had very little to do with Biden. The first thing that Trump mentioned was Crowdstrike, and then the Ambassador to the Ukraine. That Ambassador gave a long list of people that she did not want prosecuted to the Ukrainian authorities...and she just testified to congress in the impeachment inquiry. What Joe and Hunter were doing may not even be illegal, but it was corrupt and unethical.

There is a long list of people you have to think are wrong and lying, a longer list than the other side. Conspiracy theories are linked to mental illness - even if 1 out of 100 are true its dangerous to go down that road. Bidens dirty, good -out. Too old anyway, there is a long list of better qualified people. The problems is that Trump took time away from saving us from cancer from windmills to address it, should have better things to do. How much time does he have after tweeting all day?

https://news.avclub.com/george-cloon...out-1834619125

https://www.theonion.com/conspiracy-...3rPqVjSIZuh4eY

ChiefIllini1 10-17-2019 04:10 PM

Amendment to Art. 8 of Impeachment: Emoluments Clause Violation

Trump is no longer trying to hide or deny his corruption. His Chief of Staff Mick Mulvaney announced today that next year's G7 meeting will be held at Trump's Doral resort in Florida. As a reminder, the Emoluments Clause of the United States Constitution provides:

Quote:

[N]o Person holding any Office of Profit or Trust under the[] [United States], shall, without the Consent of the Congress, accept of any present, Emolument, Office, or Title, of any kind whatever, from any King, Prince, or foreign State.

U.S. CONST. Art. 1, Sec. 9, Cl. 8. It appears to me that Trump is trying to distract us from his crimes by committing new Constitutional violations. This is the Gish Gallop of crime waves!

Crystal Clearly 10-17-2019 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefIllini1 (Post 556822)
Amendment to Art. 8 of Impeachment: Emoluments Clause Violation

Trump is no longer trying to hide or deny his corruption. His Chief of Staff Mick Mulvaney announced today that next year's G7 meeting will be held at Trump's Doral resort in Florida. As a reminder, the Emoluments Clause of the United States Constitution provides:




U.S. CONST. Art. 1, Sec. 9, Cl. 8. It appears to me that Trump is trying to distract us from his crimes by committing new Constitutional violations. This is the Gish Gallop of crime waves!

"Get over it..." - Mick Mulvaney :rolleyes:

ChiefIllini1 10-17-2019 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crystal Clearly (Post 556824)
"Get over it..." - Mick Mulvaney :rolleyes:

It makes mathematical and cosmological sense for Trump Chief of Staff Mick Mulvaney to confess one crime (Ukraine) just before announcing a new crime (Doral).

Plus, it's just good manners.

MAL 10-17-2019 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefIllini1 (Post 556822)
Amendment to Art. 8 of Impeachment: Emoluments Clause Violation

Trump is no longer trying to hide or deny his corruption. His Chief of Staff Mick Mulvaney announced today that next year's G7 meeting will be held at Trump's Doral resort in Florida. As a reminder, the Emoluments Clause of the United States Constitution provides:




U.S. CONST. Art. 1, Sec. 9, Cl. 8. It appears to me that Trump is trying to distract us from his crimes by committing new Constitutional violations. This is the Gish Gallop of crime waves!

Trump is not profiting from the event. In fact he is providing the service at cost and saving the taxpayers money. Saving tax dollars is only a crime to a Democrat.

ChiefIllini1 10-17-2019 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAL (Post 556827)
Trump is not profiting from the event. In fact he is providing the service at cost and saving the taxpayers money. Saving tax dollars is only a crime to a Democrat.

MAL, please tell me you don't believe that! Doral occupancy during that time frame is 31% one month and 38% the next month. In other words, without awarding a no-bid contract to himself, he would have a ton of empty rooms. Do you think a person who steals from a charity won't steal from you?

It will be 100% profit lining the pockets of the Criminal-in-Chief, paid for by foreign countries.

And that is unconstitutional.


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