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  #11  
Old 01-13-2020
scott8303 scott8303 is offline
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Posts: 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hotdog25 View Post
Itís a great cause but how does this not count as a 4th tournament? It shows team placements on track wrestling. How are some teams able to wrestle what they want and others have to follow IHSA rules ?

I don't think those are team placements. Looks to me like an Alphabetical listing of the teams. Yes they have then 1 Bergen, 2 Broken Arrow, 3 Fort Dodge..., but that seems logical to list them with a number. Also, per the IHSA rules, teams can wrestle 4 tournaments. BTS was not considered a tourney last year.
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  #12  
Old 01-13-2020
scott8303 scott8303 is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by No BS fan View Post
Their flyer even calls it a "Premier High school tournament"
I think the PR person on the info section got carried away. The format seems like a dual and should be labeled Super Duals?

From the FAQ on OPRF web site...

What is the difference between a dual meet and a tournament?

A dual meet is a competition between two teams. It is similar to a football game or a basketball game. In a dual meet, each team sends one wrestler to compete in every weight class. For example, Team A will send one 106 pound wrestler to compete against Team B's 106 pound wrestler. The winner of the match will score team points for his team. Only the team points that are gained as a result of a match are used to determine which team wins a dual meet. In Varsity, there are 14 weight classes, so there will be 14 matches. However, a team has the right to Forfeit a weight for any reason, so there may be less than 14 matches that are actually wrestled. For more information about how dual meets are scored, click here.

A tournament is a competition between many teams. Each team submits up to 14 wrestlers (one per weight class) to wrestle against wrestlers in their same weight class. On rare occasion, the tournament host school may also submit more than 14 wrestlers, or they may submit more than one wrestler per weight class. In this case, the non-standard wrestlers will be non-scoring wrestlers, or they will only score for their separate squad (for example, the host school may also have a Junior Varsity squad wrestle in the tournament, as well). Wrestlers compete to win their weight bracket. With victories, wrestlers earn points for their team. However, there is a different scoring system in tournaments than there is for dual meets. For more information about how tournaments are scored, click here.
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  #13  
Old 01-14-2020
allpowerfuloz allpowerfuloz is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 963
Quote:
Originally Posted by scott8303 View Post
I think the PR person on the info section got carried away. The format seems like a dual and should be labeled Super Duals?

From the FAQ on OPRF web site...

What is the difference between a dual meet and a tournament?

A dual meet is a competition between two teams. It is similar to a football game or a basketball game. In a dual meet, each team sends one wrestler to compete in every weight class. For example, Team A will send one 106 pound wrestler to compete against Team B's 106 pound wrestler. The winner of the match will score team points for his team. Only the team points that are gained as a result of a match are used to determine which team wins a dual meet. In Varsity, there are 14 weight classes, so there will be 14 matches. However, a team has the right to Forfeit a weight for any reason, so there may be less than 14 matches that are actually wrestled. For more information about how dual meets are scored, click here.

A tournament is a competition between many teams. Each team submits up to 14 wrestlers (one per weight class) to wrestle against wrestlers in their same weight class. On rare occasion, the tournament host school may also submit more than 14 wrestlers, or they may submit more than one wrestler per weight class. In this case, the non-standard wrestlers will be non-scoring wrestlers, or they will only score for their separate squad (for example, the host school may also have a Junior Varsity squad wrestle in the tournament, as well). Wrestlers compete to win their weight bracket. With victories, wrestlers earn points for their team. However, there is a different scoring system in tournaments than there is for dual meets. For more information about how tournaments are scored, click here.
If the next round of duals is determined by how the first round goes then it is a tournament. If the schedule is pre made then it is a super dual. There's a difference.
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  #14  
Old 01-14-2020
eyecu2 eyecu2 is offline
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Join Date: Nov 2019
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Awards must be handed out for it to qualify as a tournament.
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  #15  
Old 01-14-2020
No BS fan No BS fan is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 220
Doesn't IHSA have rules against high schools funding youth teams?
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  #16  
Old 01-14-2020
Crystal Clearly Crystal Clearly is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Outside your house, right now
Posts: 818
Quote:
Originally Posted by opinionated View Post
starts at 10. oprf gets montini, broken arrow and liberty in that order. montini gets oprf, liberty and broken arrow.

winner of that pool gets winner of lake highland prep, tuttle, Bergen catholic and fort dodge.


Second in that pool gets second in the other pool, third gets third etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by allpowerfuloz View Post
I believe an event where results determine the teams next opponent is technically a tournament
Quote:
Originally Posted by No BS fan View Post
Their flyer even calls it a "Premier High school tournament"
Taken directly from Track: "Premier high school wrestling tournament featuring 8 top-ranked programs from across the US"

Quote:
Originally Posted by opinionated View Post
i checked the post i saw. it shows the 4th rd. as tbd. i didn't see the flyer calling it a tournament. id guess if the 4th rd. didn't get wrestled it would just be a quad like it says on the oprf schedule. either that or possibly skip ccl. it's a real good cause. you would hate to think its anything nefarious.
See above...

Quote:
Originally Posted by allpowerfuloz View Post
If the next round of duals is determined by how the first round goes then it is a tournament. If the schedule is pre made then it is a super dual. There's a difference.
This reads exactly like it is a dual team tournament, semantics perhaps.

If you look at the bracket page on Track it clearly shows that this is a dual team tournament, with pools and placement within those pools determining which teams wrestle for what place in the tournament.

Maybe the rules regarding the number of times a team or individual can participate in dual team tournaments, individual tournaments and/or team duals are different.

Some examples:
The Clash is a dual team tournament. (And a great band....)
Ironman is an individual tournament. (And a popular movie....)
Washington Super Duals is just that, a collection of teams that dual each other with their opponents pre-determined without a championship dual or a champion crowned.

I don't know what the specific rules are, I'm sure someone out there in Illinoismatmen-land does and can shed some light on this subject, without this turning into a mudslinging contest. (Doubtful)
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  #17  
Old 01-15-2020
montiniweenie's Avatar
montiniweenie montiniweenie is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 176
Cool DUAL event, NOT tournament

BTS is sanctioned as a DUAL (Quad). Montini and OPRF pride themselves on knowing (and following) the rules!!!
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  #18  
Old 01-15-2020
gulach gulach is offline
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Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 210
Does anyone really care what they call it? Let’s be happy for Mike Powell and his pursuit to make this great state relevant in this great sport of wrestling.

BTS is sponsoring the best tournament event Illinois will have this year. And there isn’t even a close second. We have an opportunity to watch some of the best teams in the country come to Illinois and wrestle. In my opinion, this will be better than the state and dual series. Where Montini won’t even be challenged. Saturday night they will be for sure! High-level tough wrestling, D1 kids.

Like I have said before Illinois wrestling needs to get a lot better! I hope this will spark some interest in some young buck kinda lost and possibly try out wrestling. Events like this give us the potential for that to happen. Taking nothing away from Hinsdale Central and Lemont or basically any other Illinois school, any kid interested in wrestling and watching that dual I don’t think he is running home and asking for wrestling shoes.

Let's show them a great turnout!

Orlando
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  #19  
Old 01-16-2020
lauden swain lauden swain is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,869
Beat the Streets Chicago has organized for a second straight year the Beat the Streets Brawl, which will be held this Saturday at Oak Park River Forest (Ill.). Like last year, the field is again loaded with top end teams from across the country and has some other events tied to it. The event also serves as a key fundraiser for the sponsoring organization, which is helping to provide wrestling and related programming to boys and girls in the city of Chicago.

Saturday's event has a youth clinic being conducted by Kyven Gadson from 9 a.m. to noon CT in addition to the four rounds of dual meet competition. The dual meet competition results, brackets, and streaming will be available on TrackWrestling.com

The eight teams are split into two pools as follows:

Pool 1: No. 4 Montini Catholic (Ill.), No. 24 Broken Arrow (Okla.), No. 25 Liberty (Mo.), and Oak Park River Forest (Ill.)

Pool 2: No. 6 Lake Highland Prep (Fla.), No. 7 Bergen Catholic (N.J.), No. 14 Tuttle (Okla.), and No. 43 Fort Dodge (Okla.)

Below is the schedule of matches:

10 a.m. CT: Oak Park River Forest vs. Montini Catholic, Broken Arrow vs. Liberty; Lake Highland Prep vs. Fort Dodge, Tuttle vs Bergen Catholic

Noon: Montini Catholic vs. Liberty, Broken Arrow vs. Oak Park River Forest; Lake Highland Prep vs. Tuttle, Bergen Catholic vs. Fort Dodge

2 p.m.: Montini Catholic vs. Broken Arrow, Oak Park River Forest vs. Liberty; Tuttle vs. Fort Dodge, Lake Highland Prep vs Bergen Catholic

4 p.m.: Crossover matches based on finish in preliminary pool

The following are projected lineups for each of the competing teams:

No. 4 Montini Catholic (Ill.)
106: Joseph Fernau, 16U Nationals double All-American
113: Nick Gonalez, state runner-up
120: Nain Vazquez, two-time state 4th place
126: No. 8 Dylan Ragusin
132: Ethan Stiles, 16U Nationals freestyle All-American
138: Braden Stauffenberg
145: No. 15 Fidel Mayora
152: Joe Roberts, two-time state placer
160: Brayden Thompson, 16U Nationals freestyle All-American
170: Cooper Wettig
182: Trevor Swier, three-time state qualifier (2019 state 3rd place)
195: Josh LaBarbera, two-time state qualifier
220: Nathan Wenstrom
285: Colin Baker

No. 6 Lake Highland Prep (Fla.)
106: Eligh Rivera, 6th place Walsh Ironman
113: David McClelland
120: Danny Nini, two-time state placer (2018 state champion)
126: Jake Wohltman, three-time state placer
132: No. 15 Chris Rivera
138: No. 7 Justin Rivera
145: TBD
152: No. 12 Noah Castillo
160: Dominic Isola, two-time state placer
170: Bailey Flanagan, 2018 state placer
182: Hunter Brinkman, state 5th place
195: Easton Tobia
220: Matthew Kaplan, state champ
285: Francisco Tobar

No. 7 Bergen Catholic (N.J.)
106: Aiden Wallace
113: No. 14 Joseph Cangro
120: Nick Kayal, three-time state placer
126: No. 3 Robert Howard or Riley Halal
132: No. 17 Dylan Cedeno
138: *Will Grater (two-time state 8th place) or Eric Broadie
145: No. 16 Joseph Zargo
152: Alex Strashinsky, state 6th place
160: Nate Camiscioli, 6th place Doc Buchanan (at 152)
170: Justin Onello
182: Jack Patti
195: John Fiore
220: Nate Lewis or Nicholas Fuccilli
285: *Remy Brancotta (state qualifier) or Rafi Bailey
*transfer in from other school, may or may not be eligible this week due to "sit-out" rule

No. 14 Tuttle (Okla.)
106: Braden Potts
113: Ashton Grounds, two-time state 3rd place
120: *Garrett Steidley (two-time state champ) or Braden Hughart
126: Reese Davis, state runner-up
132: Dalton Burdick
138: Ryder Ramsey, two-time state champ
145: Bryce Dauphin, state runner-up
152: Brady DeArmond, state champ
160: Gage Shetley
170: **Luke Surber (two-time state champ/three-time state finalist) or Sam Schmidt
182: **Dustin Plott (two-time state champ/three-time state finalist) or Parrish Terry
195: Harley Andrews, state runner-up
220: Colin Naney, 2018 state runner-up
285: Korben Graham
*has been out for recent events due to injury
**has been out season-to-date due to injury, Oklahoma State signee was a Junior National freestyle All-American this past summer

No. 24 Broken Arrow (Okla.)
106: Christian Forbes, 16U Nationals double All-American
113: Parker Witcraft
120: Bryce Cockrell, state 3rd place
126: Jackson Cockrell, state runner-up
132: Blazik Perez, two-time state qualifier
138: Jared Hill, two-time state placer
145: Chris Moores
152: William Martin
160: Tye Rozell, state qualifier
170: Bryce Mattioda, three-time state placer/two-time state runner-up
182: Zeno Marcheselli
195: Emmanuel Skillings, state champ
220: Mitchell Banning
285: Marlon Welty

No. 25 Liberty (Mo.)
106: Mason Younghans
113: Easton Hilton, state champ
120: No. 5 Jeremiah Reno
126: Ayden Dolt, state qualifier (also Preseason Nationals FR/SO champ)
132: Kyle Dutton, state 4th place
138: Kage Lenger, two-time state qualifier (2018 state placer)
145: Logan Rathjen, state qualifier
152: Jacob Lynn, 2018 state 6th place
160: Drake Smith, state 3rd place
170: Wentric Williams III, state 6th place
182: No. 4 Greyden Penner
195: Jack Horn
220: Callum Trester
285: Nick Biesemeyer

No. 43 Fort Dodge (Iowa)
106: Max Bishop
113: Lane Cowell, state 4th place
120: No. 2 Drake Ayala
126: Carson Taylor, state champ/2x state placer
132: Brooks Cowell, state 5th place
138: Dreyzon Phillips, state qualifier
145: Brandon Mills
152: Kody Cook, state qualifier
160: Savion Wheat, state qualifier
170: Dylan Zimmerman
182: Austin Lee, 2018 state qualifier
195: Levi Egli, 2018 state 5th place
220: Sawyer Springer
285: Colton Munter

Oak Park River Forest (Ill.)
106: Zavien Stewart
113: Jalen Dunson
120: Connor Nagela
126: No. 9 Jacob Rundell
132: Nico Bolivar, state 5th place/3x state qualifier
138: TBD
145: Joshua Ogunsanya, state 4th place
152: Joe Chapman, two-time state placer
160: Stephon Carr
170: Adrian Palmares
182: Danny Lingen, state qualifier
195: No. 15 Daemyen Middlebrooks
220: Malcolm Gray
285: Fabian Gonzalez
__________________
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  #20  
Old 01-17-2020
GrossNoises GrossNoises is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 394
This is a tournament as defined by the IHSA handbook:

Tournament — A competition involving three or more schools in which teams and/or athletes compete under an elimination and/or round
robin format within a 10 consecutive week day period which results in a single winner of the competition and or event(s). No regular
season tournament shall allow for a member school to participate in more than five (5) games/contests/matches. IHSA By-law 5.004
provides an exception for wrestling tournaments, and baseball/softball tournaments when schools are on spring break.

https://www.ihsa.org/documents/forms...A_Handbook.pdf

It has nothing to do with awards being handed out as that is nowhere in the handbook. Montini and OPRF both violated this rule last year and should they compete in another individual tournament they will be in violation again this year as defined by the IHSA. The rule change in effect next year will render this obsolete, but save your feelings. This is a violation of the obscure rules of the IHSA.

As for who cares? People with integrity. Please, save your emotional responses as I am just providing the rules as written. I could careless myself. It took me 3 seconds to find this rule violation while taking a dump.
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